- minds-disaster@lists.redbrick.dcu.ie

[Minds-disaster] To do...
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

Right, I have a lot of favours to ask.... Cian: Can you draw up document stating how secure Minds is, including but not limited to how it compares to NT machines. I would prefer if you didn't mention the security of the CS machines. Darragh/Aidan/Meaigs: A history of what the society has done. I'll be getting letters of support off as many Netsocs as I can simply stating that it's a good idea to have one; aswell as writing up an article on the Clubs and Socs "Nervecenter" myself and Aidan were working on before this thing went down. I want to have a document we can hand the Computer Centre saying what we have done, how secure our system is, what we were planning on doing for the future, how important the society is to other clubs and socs and also stating that closing down the Minds system is effectively a death knell to what we do/will do. Attached will be letters of support from as many Netsocs/Companies/Organisations as we can get. And I want this all on our end by this Friday and other places by next Wednesday. I'll talk to Stephen Brown about this... but I don't want to keep on going through the CS Dept for information. We should be told what the CC are planning as it affects us all, by the CC; and we should also make our voice heard directly. I obviously don't want to keep the CS Dept in the dark about this. Lets get to work. David

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Re: [Minds-disaster] The Story With Access
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

> It needs to be made clear to the CC *NOW* how much we are worth to the students of > the college and also to the "college", before documents are drawn up. By the way, I'll have a proposal drawn up for Wednesday morning to submit to them. David

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Re: [Minds-disaster] The Story With Access
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

bart.busschots(a)physics.org wrote: > The way Stephen Brown invisages getting MiNDS> back up is in small steps > with the ultimate aim of getting back everything we had. Kevin brought up the point of lawyers fees ... if the CC invest lawyers fees each time they draw up a policy document will there be a point where it is too expensive to allow Minds back up again? The consensus reached was that it would be at the first draft. > The Plan is indeed to give us full root access but to put us behind a > firewall. The plan according to Stephen Brown... not the CC, who's voice unfortunately has more clout than the CS Dept > The first step will be just internal access from the CS department, then > when the fire wall is inplace internal access in the college and then > eventually full access. Telnet and FTP will probably come before any > other outside access, i.e. www. If we don't have www workings we can't host intersocs. If we can't host intersocs we're letting down Redbrick and Compsoc Galway. > The reason for this is that the college is liable for any thing that is > said on a web page in the college. Perhaps we could buy an IP from them? > Before we rush into any thing I think we should give the CS department > the chance to work their magic. Again, lawyers fees. > In time all this will die down and when Dr. Smyth forgets about all this > the CC may be a bit more accomodating too. Again, lawyers fees and "is minds worth this cash we spent?" It needs to be made clear to the CC *NOW* how much we are worth to the students of the college and also to the "college", before documents are drawn up. David

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[Minds-disaster] The Story With Access
by Bart Busschots 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

Hi All, Just to clear a few things up. The way Stephen Brown invisages getting MiNDS> back up is in small steps with the ultimate aim of getting back everything we had. This will take time but we will be inching towards our goal all the time. The Plan is indeed to give us full root access but to put us behind a firewall. The first step will be just internal access from the CS department, then when the fire wall is inplace internal access in the college and then eventually full access. Telnet and FTP will probably come before any other outside access, i.e. www. The reason for this is that the college is liable for any thing that is said on a web page in the college. Before we rush into any thing I think we should give the CS department the chance to work their magic. In time all this will die down and when Dr. Smyth forgets about all this the CC may be a bit more accomodating too. Regards, Bart. __________________________ Bart Busschots bart.busschots(a)physics.org

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RE: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

"yr40017(a)cs.may.ie" <yr40017(a)cs.may.ie> wrote: > If yous want to get an outside host just get someone who has digital cable > installed in their house, Chorus are currently rolling it out at the > moment. I am getting cable installed in my house as soon as it is > available. Permanent connection for just the monthly line rental of ?19 > All yous would need is some sort of hub to attach all the machines to the > one cable How much bandwidth is there in/out? That's a lot of money for a year, if you take power usage for 3 machines into account. David

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RE: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by Darragh Sherwin 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

If yous want to get an outside host just get someone who has digital cable installed in their house, Chorus are currently rolling it out at the moment. I am getting cable installed in my house as soon as it is available. Permanent connection for just the monthly line rental of ?19 All yous would need is some sort of hub to attach all the machines to the one cable _________________________ Darragh Sherwin yr40017(a)cs.may.ie -----Original Message----- From: David Barrett [SMTP:mindschair@eircom.net] Sent: 11 December 2000 11:22 To: minds-disaster(a)redbrick.dcu.ie Subject: Re: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown The Geek Goddess of Love <afrodite(a)redbrick.dcu.ie> wrote: > > > The attack launched by sargon had nothing to do with anyone having root. > > It's no longer about Sargon's attack... it's about policy, of letting students use *shock horror* college resources. > > Well, I find the restrictions y9ou've outlined so far unacceptable. And if the > college persists, I think you should look into some kind of outside host. ?3,500 for eircom. David _______________________________________________ Minds-disaster mailing list Minds-disaster(a)lists.Redbrick.dcu.ie http://lists.Redbrick.dcu.ie/mailman/listinfo/minds-disaster

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Re: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

The Geek Goddess of Love <afrodite(a)redbrick.dcu.ie> wrote: > > > The attack launched by sargon had nothing to do with anyone having root. > > It's no longer about Sargon's attack... it's about policy, of letting students use *shock horror* college resources. > > Well, I find the restrictions y9ou've outlined so far unacceptable. And if the > college persists, I think you should look into some kind of outside host. �3,500 for eircom. David

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Re: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

The Geek Goddess of Love <afrodite(a)redbrick.dcu.ie> wrote: > On Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 06:47:00PM +0000, David Barrett wrote: > > Another one of the rules that the CC wanted was no student root access. NONE. The CS Dept are trying to get imaginative on this. > > No way. Not acceptable. > Our machine was better administrated than the solaris system in the college > (obviously, we have less to manage, but the point still stands) > > The CS Dept don't have the resources to manage a machine specifically for > students, and even if they did it would defeat half the purpose. Erk. The CS Dept think they could get us access to our own machine within the CS Dept and with no access to/from outside; and then supervised access for other machines. Still silly though. > The attack launched by sargon had nothing to do with anyone having root. It's no longer about Sargon's attack... it's about policy, of letting students use *shock horror* college resources. David

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Re: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

The Geek Goddess of Love <afrodite(a)redbrick.dcu.ie> wrote: > > Erm, it's our machine. They wanted root access barred from everyone who wasn't staff. Not even with JC's supervision. That's how I read it, which is freaking nonsense as it's our machine. > > Unfortunately, it is nonsense we may have to learn to live with. > There has to be some way you can fight it. It's idiocy. What's the point in us > having a machine if we can't run it ourselves ? It's better than nothing. Not that much better though. The thing IS, at the moment the CC are playing hardball while the CS Dept are trying to save us... but he only way they can save us and keep themselves okay with the rest of the college is to try and go with the trinity rules (my opinion only). If we get the Trinity Netsoc rules, we'll push them as far as we can (perhaps to the point of a mass protest with other Netsocs) David

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Re: [Minds-disaster] Met with Stephen Brown
by David Barrett 11 Dec '00

11 Dec '00

The Geek Goddess of Love <afrodite(a)redbrick.dcu.ie> wrote: > First of all, can you post a copy of the Trinity netsoc rules to this list ? > Secondly, will these new rules only apply to MiNDS> or will the whole college > system be subject to them ? Er, I don't even think that the emails on the Netsoc in Trinity work externally. I'll email the college proper... problem is, they're off on holidays. If I don't get them by tommorrow, I'll get them off Stephen Brown > If these proposed rules are as strict as I think they are, I think you should > fight them. I think we should let the CS Dept get as far as they can, and THEN we should go in. > Tehy seem to completely negate the entire point of MiNDS>, and I'm very angry > at the small-mindedness that can't see the value of a society like MiNDS>. I can understand where they're coming from... just the way they want to go around things is pretty stupid. David

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